A Post, A Response, and a Resource.

[browngirl]

So _dahne_'s post calling for an end to social justice in fandom is being much discussed. I took down my post from yesterday, which was more emotional and disorganized than I like, and instead of rewriting it I'll link to this response at foc_u.

Also, brighteyed_jill has linked to the sensible post, On Having That Conversation. This is the post that _dahne_ purports to have written, but hers is very much not.

Now, having said all that, I'm going to go work on a story for my next post here.

Comments

[secretsolitaire.livejournal.com]

Thanks for those links. ♥

[rubynye.livejournal.com]

*blush* Thank you for your comment here, and your supportive comments there, to me and to others. Thank you, a lot.

[amazonziti.livejournal.com]

Thank you for the links, lady. I do not have the personal bandwidth to get involved in that clusterfuck right now (but Jesus when I read through it did I want to say something), but I'm glad to know what's going on, and when I have a moment of spare time I rather think I'll go through the comments on _dahne_'s post and add LJ notes to the profiles of all the people who think zie's clever or enlightened. It's like a neat list of People I Do Not Need to Know, Ever.

Thanks for signal-boosting, again, and if you're involved in this, let me know if there's anything I can do to lend you my support. ♥ Will I see you tomorrow, BTW?

[swingandswirl]

Thank you for the links. I'm not commenting at the moment because the extent of my response is RAAAAAAAGE FLAIL RAAAAAAAAGE atm, but it's good to know what's going on, even if it's taking a piledriver to what's left of my faith in humanity.

Also, yay for Ruby!fic. :D

[rubynye.livejournal.com]

*beams* Hi, milady. I think... there are a lot of people I know who are people of goodwill and sense who think she had a point and so may be swayed into thinking all her points are good. I don't at all want to write them off but I want to say publicly that her actual message is much more pernicious than it may seem at first glance. So.

I hope to be there tomorrow, but I'll have to see. If I'm not, sometime soon. *crosstown hugs*

[rubynye.livejournal.com]

*blushes at you* Don't let me ramp up your blood pressure! But now you know, at least.

And, thanks. :)

[weepingnaiad.livejournal.com]

*hugs tight*

I'm not sorry I missed _dahne_'s post, but I am sorry that I was not here to at least give you a hug and support.

I do want to say that foc_u's post and subsequent, concrete example about that Inception fic was amazing and so well done. It really clarified points for me and brought home some things that I hadn't considered before. Very enlightening. Truly.

Thank you, bb!

*hugs*
WN

[flwrpwr-vampyre.livejournal.com]

I don't even know how to respond to dahne since the response boils down to 'How the fuck is trying not to be racist and ablist and, I don't know, a decent person equal being too politically correct?'

We at least agree on one thing, the term politically correct has gone on too far since people can say horrible things and then just whine that they don't have to be pc and how dare we try and make them.

[karadin.livejournal.com]

All I could think of when I read that is 'the lady doth protest too much.' I guess she must have written something that made her look like an idiot.

[thistlerose.livejournal.com]

Thank you for posting these links. I'm sorry I couldn't lend my support yesterday. I managed to slog through _dahne_'s original whine and the comments last night, but I was too beat to formulate coherent thoughts, never mind type them out.

[rabidsamfan.livejournal.com]

I did try to respond to dahne, but I probably used too many words. Her entire whine struck me as "I don't wanna read about this again!" and I got distracted by elucidating why I think the conversations she's tired of keep appearing over and over.

What I probably should have said was "If you're not interested then use the power of the back button and go away. Other people ARE interested and can survive having a discussion without you."

[juliansinger.livejournal.com]

I dunno, I thought that post of yours was plenty eloquent. (Which is to say, thank you for it.)

And! Thank you for the other link.

[starsandgraces]

You know how I feel about this entire thing already, so I won't reiterate it. And I will be checking these links out, thank you!

[hoosierbitch.livejournal.com]

Thank you for standing up and speaking out about this. I wouldn't have heard about it without your signal boost, and when I got to the post, I went kind of incoherent with disbelief. So thank you for speaking so eloquently about it. I'll be signal-boosting later, and linking to the places that you linked, if you don't mind a copycat!

♥

[igrockspock.livejournal.com]

Those are excellent posts you linked! I am among those who weren't around for the initial posting _dahne_'s rant, but having read it now, I'm grateful that others were able to comment on it articulately. I'm just so baffled and appalled to even know what to say about it myself.

[capra-maritimus.livejournal.com]

*huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuugs*

I'd rather be able to do this personally. :/

So sorry you have to deal with this. Again.

*more hugs*

And those links are great. Have bookmarked them. :D

[brighteyed-jill.livejournal.com]

Thanks for the signal-boost! I'm trying not to get bogged down and angry at that whole mess over yonder, but rather think positively about how better conversations can take place.

I also liked foc_u's thoughtful takedown of the original clusterfuck. Thanks for the one-stop-shopping for thoughtful discourse!

Also: yay stories!

[arcane_lark.livejournal.com]

You know, I've recently been spending a lot of time helping my (straight, white, cismale) boyfriend understand the concept of privilege. And I'm amazed at how much he's struggling with it-- the idea that even though he's trying to be nice, he's actually being a dick and hurting people's feelings. And that's with me educating him, someone who cares about him and is reassuring him at every turn.

I can't imagine what it would be to learn about this on the internet, where there isn't always that trust and support, and it IS easier to dismiss it when you don't have to look at anyone when you do it. And I'm a little ashamed to say that a year ago, I might have done the same thing. I have been lucky enough to have wonderful friends and professors to help me learn to check my privileges without getting defensive, but so many people don't have that. And I do feel bad for them.

Being confused and overwhelmed and scared isn't an excuse for being a dick, but it does explain it a little bit. Just goes to show how desperately we need things to change, so that it isn't scary to treat other people like, you know... people.

And your stories always make me happy, whether it be social justice happy or twisted dark happy or anything in between.

[sail-aweigh.livejournal.com]

Thanks for the links, bb. Especially that last link from brighteyed_jill. I used to have a lot of those links that were posted at the end, but I lost them with a hard drive crash a couple of years ago and I've been too lazy to search them out. Now, I've got that post tagged on delicious so I won't lose them again.

And, yay, fic!

[jadelennox]

I admit, I've been spending this week saying, "Oh, that _dahne_'s a tool, oh well, good thing zie's friendless COMMENTS WHAT COMMENTS OF COURSE THERE ARE NO COMMENTS ON THAT POST I'VE GOT MY FINGERS IN MY EARS AND I'M SINGING LALALALA."

*is ashamed*

[mercaque.livejournal.com]

I found dahne's post via your link last night, and was really shocked (although a big part of me knows I shouldn't have been) and very disheartened at how many people gave such unconditional support for its message. I don't quite know what else to say - there's so much wrong with that post it's hard to know where to start - but I wanted to thank you for signalboosting it, and to register my support for you and my disgust with dahne's post.

[janice-lester.livejournal.com]

I honestly don't know how you can deal with this stuff as often and as eloquently as you do. Reading her post and some of the comments is all I have spoons for. I feel incapable of lifting a finger to add a comment, even with a sock-puppet. I recognised a few usernames associated with comments in support of the screed, and it feels like being betrayed. I can't deal with it. All those allegedly cis, white, straight, able, etc., people who allegedly don't have the "right" to be offended or upset or angered by "PC" language--I NEED them on days like these. I can't effectively advocate for myself over issues that make me cry.

I guess I just fundamentally don't get why it is wrong to assume that people generally are interested in being good people, decent people, perhaps even better people. But, apparently, improving onself is a niche interest, like botany, and letting someone know how they could stop inadvertently causing pain all around them is akin to bullying. Grgh. Excuse me while my head explodes.

Oh, and ♥. You're awesome, just so you know.

[jerusha.livejournal.com]

<reads _dahne_'s post

*headdesk* *headdesk* *headdesk*

[rubynye.livejournal.com]

Oh, goodness. *hugs you back* It was only yesterday, and anyway... this is just a PSA post, really. And you're very welcome. :)

[rubynye.livejournal.com]

Oh, I say unto thee: word.